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"With the Beatles" by the Beatles

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"With the Beatles" by the Beatles

Episode Transcript

Joe: Welcome to Prime Factors Music. This week, With the Beatles.

Journalist (interview): How long do you think Beatlemania will last?

Beatle (interview): As long as you all keep coming.

Joe: Welcome back to Prime Factors Music. This week we're covering With the Beatles, the second studio album from the Beatles. Abram, do you have any thoughts?

Abram: I think this is better than the first. Because we listened to this, like, I would like to say, like, four days ago-ish. So I think it's pretty good. So, like, no, we don't want to spoil it for our listeners. My opinion is that it has songs that are better than the original and songs that are about as bad as the original.

Abram: Or, like, it's— I would say it's essentially the original scale shifted up by, like, a point or so. So what are your thoughts?

Joe: Well, I don't want to spoil my thoughts until the end of the album, but I think I broadly agree with you. But Abram, can you tell us about the album?

Abram: This album was released on November 22nd, 1963. American historians might know that day is the day John F. Kennedy was killed, but I'll get to that more later in the A Hard Day's Night episode. This album doesn't require nearly as much background as their first, and not as much as their next, A Hard Day's Night.

Abram: I'll have to talk about Ed Sullivan, Beatlemania, and the movie. So I wonder if we're gonna have to watch the movie before recording the next one.

Abram: Anyways, about this album, let's see if our thoughts hold up for now. Let's see. So drum roll please for track 1, "It Won't Be Long." What do you think?

Joe: I like this song as an opener.

Abram: Yeah, it works well as an opener. It's— I don't think it would work pretty much anywhere as a not opener though.

Joe: Yeah, it definitely continues the Beatles' streak during this period of having every song being about relationships. I don't think that's going to end in this album at all.

Abram: I think it's going to stop being about like either people being away or relationships. Those are currently the only themes in Beatles songs. That'll probably change with Beatles for Sale. Because they start to get really upset around that album.

Joe: Well, it's, you know, they had all those screaming young female fans. I'm sure they were trying to cater to their interests.

Abram: Yeah, so I think it's pretty good. I like the call and response. Could you tell what the backing vocals were saying?

Joe: No.

Abram: Like, that's one of my bigger issues with this song. It's impossible to know what the backing vocals were saying.

Joe: So I have a question. So was this a cover or written by the Beatles?

Abram: This was a Beatles song. No penalties.

Joe: Who wrote it?

Abram: This was a Lennon-McCartney. I think it was a collaboration. I'm not as good at the early songs.

Joe: I see. So overall, I'm thinking that it's a 7.

Abram: Yeah, I would say 7. It's pretty good. I would say it's more polished than "I Saw Her Standing There," which is in a way its rival track, but I like them about the same. They each have advantages. And weaknesses. Not many weaknesses, mostly advantages, but I would say I'm also going with a 7.

Joe: Excellent.

Abram: Now, a drum roll please for track 2, "All I've Got to Do." What do you think of it?

Joe: Is this like the biggest Beatles song that involves humming?

Abram: No, "Yesterday" has humming.

Joe: Oh, it does.

Abram: I know there are more, but humming— this is probably the one that uses it for the longest, but this is by far, far from the only song that uses it.

Joe: So this song seems very throwback again. It's, it's 1950s.

Abram: It's a really good song, but I have three issues with it. One, the vocals. They clearly weren't putting in their best performance.

Joe: Okay, I'll buy that their singing isn't quite as strong.

Abram: Example two, the drums. They do not hit— they don't hit the snare enough. That's the best drum. Sorry if you don't think so, but my main issue with the song is it just goes, "Duh-duh-duh-duh, t-tuh-duh-duh, pfft." Like, it doesn't have enough energy to it.

Abram: My third issue, it doesn't have energy to it. This is a really good song, though I think it would have worked better as like a mid-side song rather than very beginning, considering the next song is much more energetic than it and should have just followed "It Won't Be Long." I'm only giving this song a 5.

Joe: I'm going 5 too.

Abram: I think it's about average. Okay, now drum roll please for track 3, "All My Loving." What do you think of this?

Joe: I like it. It's a more sophisticated style. It reminds me a lot of "It Won't Be Long." It's sort of—

Abram: It's sort of like this is Paul's first song in the album. I feel like they essentially decided to take the style from the first two songs and make something really good out of it.

Joe: Although that could be a good justification for why the second song is where it is on the album.

Abram: Yeah, except it un-advances "It Won't Be Long." Maybe so. So I think this is really good. Its only downside is that I feel like it's held back by its era. I just feel like their instrumentation wasn't the best. It's a bit simplistic. I'm thinking of what they could have even included though.

Abram: I think definitely like more advanced drumming could have been good. I think like softer guitars, like instead of like monotone-ish guitars. But this is a really good song. I don't think it's better than "It Won't Be Long," but I think it's better than "All I've Got to Do." It's on par with "It Won't Be Long."

Joe: Well, I'm gonna rate it a 6.

Abram: Why?

Joe: Because that is the honest rating that I have.

Abram: I'm rating it a 7, which is too bad for us because that means our rating will say the forbidden number. But I think it's on par with "It Won't Be Long."

Abram: Drum roll please for track 4, "Don't Bother Me." What do you think?

Joe: Well, that song sounds very different than the others. Is that a different song type?

Abram: It's not a cover, but it is a Hera song, which is a term for George Harrison. It's actually George Harrison's first song he wrote for the Beatles, and probably the first song he wrote. I'm not sure on that. Might have written like a— or no, he wrote "Cry for a Shadow" with the Quarrymen, or I'm not sure if it's the Quarrymen or the very early Beatles. I think it's very early Beatles.

Abram: I feel like he continues the style of the first three songs.

Joe: Yeah, it's, it's very much a continuation.

Abram: I would say it's George's take on "All I've Gotta Do." He does a better job than "All I've Gotta Do," but it isn't like an amazing song, unlike songs like "Here Comes the Sun." And if you really want to hear my controversial opinions, "Think for Yourself."

Joe: Well, we'll have plenty of time for your controversial opinions as we go. We'll get to that on its album, Rubber Soul. Right.

Abram: So I think that it's in between "It Won't Be Long" and "All My Loving" and "All I've Gotta Do," so I would put it at a 6.

Joe: And I'm also gonna give it a 6.

Abram: Okay, now drum roll please for track 5. And it's "Little Child." Uh, oh no. I want to like this song. It is the best backing track so far, except the harmonica solo. That's garbage.

Abram: But I really wanna like this song, but the lyrics— they're repetitive and they're— mm, what they're singing about is entirely inappropriate. Let me just read you the lyrics. "Little child, little child, little child, won't you dance with me? I'm so sad and lonely, baby, take a chance with me." That repeats before, "If you want someone to make you feel so fine, then we'll have some fun when you're mine, all mine. So come on, come on, come on." That's the exact thing a kidnapper would say.

Joe: It does continue the Beatles' trend of having two very inappropriate songs in their first two albums.

Abram: Yeah.

Joe: Now in their defense, at least this time they didn't specify an age, but "Little Child"—

Abram: Child, I don't think should mean anyone like above like 9. So technically does, but I wouldn't use it for anyone above like 9.

Joe: It's icky.

Abram: Yeah, at least it's not as bad as "Run for Your Life." Imagine if "Run for Your Life" is "Run for Your Life," but the singer's Maxwell Edison.

Joe: Okay, we'll talk about that on some later album.

Abram: Mm-hmm.

Joe: So how do we rate a song that is really awful in content but decent musically?

Abram: The music, I would rate like an 8 or a 9. It's by far the best so far. It doesn't really fit with the previous ones, which I would say means it's an 8 instead of a 9, but it's good. But the lyrics, if they were put onto, say, your average song, I think it would lower the song. I'm rating this a 6 because I think it's pretty good with horrible lyrics. What do you think?

Joe: I don't think it's musically as good as you do, but also I really, really dislike the lyrics. I'm debating between a 3 or a 4.

Abram: Drum roll please for what he gives it.

Joe: 3.

Abram: You hate this song.

Joe: That is our largest difference between us.

Abram: Yeah, I get where you're going, but I don't really like the song. I don't like harmonica so well. But the issue is I want to like it. Do you agree?

Joe: You can want to like it. I want to move to the next song.

Abram: Drum roll for track 6, please. "Till There Was You," first cover. For a cover, I like this. I really like the, like, sort of riff guitar. I don't really like— it's like chord guitar, if you know what I mean. I don't know which one's lead and rhythm, but—

Joe: Abram, I'm just curious, what— like there was a different instrument there. Like it sounded like a Spanish guitar.

Abram: Yeah, it's a Spanish guitar.

Joe: Oh wow.

Abram: Yeah, it's a cover. They can do that.

Joe: Yeah, I was about to say it sounded vaguely European and then I realized they're the Beatles. They are European.

Abram: Mm-hmm. It's probably much easier for them.

Abram: I said that I wanted the "Ask Me Why" solo. You liked the solo in this one? By that I did not mean I like the solo. I meant that it would fit "Ask Me Why" decently well. I find the song fine. I would rate it a 6. What about you?

Joe: 5.

Abram: Why?

Joe: It's a good question. It's just the song is perfectly fine. It is a good song.

Abram: The issue is it's a cover, which means you're rating it a 4 and I'm doing it 5. But it's nothing amazing, but it's fine.

Abram: Now a drum roll for track 7, "Please Mr. Postman." This song's fine musically. I want to talk about the lyrics. Why is the narrator expecting his postman to be a therapist?

Joe: I don't think he's expecting his postman to be a therapist, but he's just hoping and praying that a letter—

Abram: Yeah, but how would that— how would the postman be able to control anything? Listen to this. "You didn't stop to make me feel better" is the lyric. Why would he do that?

Joe: Well, I don't know that I agree or disagree with the story of the song, but the idea is he's just like, please check, is there a letter for me in your bag? Can you just check again?

Abram: He's going to do that anyways. I would say this is like a— it's better than the last cover, a 7.

Joe: Well, I need to talk about this song, Abram.

Abram: What?

Joe: I'm sorry, what? So "Mr. Postman" is a super important and famous song in the history of music. "Mr. Postman" is the very first Motown song to ever reach number 1 on the Billboard Hot 100. It was originally written by or for the Marvelettes, which is an all-woman Motown singing group.

Joe: And the Beatles did gender swap this time, unlike with "Boys" where they kept it as "Boys." This time they gender swapped some of the lyrics. But this song, which they covered in '63 after it had reached number 1 in '61, is a breakout that is one of the first, for lack of a better word, Black musical number 1 hits that came out of Motown. And that, quite frankly, is because it's a great song.

Abram: It is.

Joe: So I'm giving it a 7, but I think we have to give it a cover penalty.

Abram: We are. We always do that.

Joe: Mm-hmm.

Abram: So both of us give it a 6.

Joe: I gave Abram info. Isn't that great?

Abram: You always do that. This is my podcast.

Abram: Okay, now for track 8, the third cover in a row. "Roll Over Beethoven." Very good song in my opinion. I don't get why Totalus Rankium's hating on this.

Joe: Well, Totalus Rankium is wrong.

Abram: Yeah, I agree.

Joe: So this song, by the way, Abram, is a Chuck Berry song. Chuck Berry, 1956. And the lyrics are really a celebration.

Abram: Yeah, they're like a bunch of different songs, so making references.

Joe: Yes, it is absolutely a celebration of rock and roll. And Chuck Berry does an amazing version that's honestly better than the Beatles, but the Beatles did a pretty good version. A pretty good version.

Abram: Like the entire, like, last two-thirds are just references.

Joe: Yeah, it's really good. I sang this song when I was a kid.

Abram: I have one issue at the beginning and one issue at the end. The beginning, the guitar sounds like a banjo. Like, I don't feel like it's rocking enough.

Abram: And at the end, this one I will have to play— the last chord's edited on.

Joe: Yes.

Abram: And you can tell because all the instruments but the guitar drop out, so they must have only used the guitar from that last chord.

Joe: I think your definition of obvious edit and mine is slightly different, Abram.

Abram: I'm going to see what the All the Songs book has to say about it. Do they mention it?

Joe: Who wrote and sang that?

Abram: That was a Paul song. This song was actually proposed for Please Please Me. I'm glad that it got booted off here. It works much better on this album.

Joe: Yeah, I agree. I like this song a lot. Oh, I just realized another reason why I like "Roll Over Beethoven." I just realized it's the first not-love song in the Beatles corpus. It's not the first not-love cover.

Abram: No, "There's a Place." It mentions love, but it's not about love.

Joe: Really?

Abram: "There's a Place" says like, "I love only you," but that's the only mention to love in the song. The rest of the song is about a place where the singer can go when he doesn't feel good, which might be with the person he likes, but it's— that's why it isn't like—

Joe: It's love adjacent. It's not love.

Abram: Yeah.

Joe: Anyway, back to this song. I really like the sort of call and response pieces.

Abram: What I also really like is after the mid-late, the really low section. I just really like afterwards the drums try to get revenge for not appearing at all during that section. Ringo just starts crashing away at the cymbals.

Joe: Yeah, I can see that.

Abram: I really like this song. Fun error, like the last song. One person says, "It feels so right now." Paul says one thing, John says another. "It feels so right now," or "It feels so right so"? So they end up saying, "It feels so right, so." That's funny. This is just a funny song. I'm rating it a 7.

Joe: And I'm also rating it a 7.

Abram: Not a cover. Next song is a cover. Drum roll for track 10! "You Really Got a Hold on Me." What do you think of this song?

Joe: Well, this song continues the Beatles' celebration of American music. This is also a Motown track.

Abram: This is a Smokey Robinson.

Joe: Smokey Robinson and the Miracles, 1962.

Abram: How do you know this much? This is my podcast.

Joe: Abram is gonna kick me out. I'm gonna be quiet now.

Abram: Yeah, you can keep on talking. Fine.

Joe: No, I just love that the Beatles are really paying homage to the whole American musical experience.

Abram: Yeah, this is also their first song to pass three minutes. They don't get an original though to do that until "Ticket to Ride" a year later.

Joe: Well, anyway, I like this song. I don't think it's as good as some of the other covers that they did. I just don't think they have like a deep enough soul sound to really make this song work, so I'm not rating it as high. But I really love that they're covering it as like—

Abram: Yeah, it's a decent song. I would rate it a 6.

Joe: Yeah, I'm rating it a 6 as well.

Abram: Cover, so it's 5. Now track 11, Ringo's thing on this album, a Rolling Stones hit, "I Wanna Be Your Man." Something that might surprise you is Ringo's the one in the chorus who's singing. That sounds a bit high for Ringo.

Joe: No, Ringo's a good artist. Yeah, I think he gets a bad rap.

Abram: Me too. It says "voice the world's best train," after all. Kind of, he's the narrator.

Joe: I don't know, that show is a little bit young for me.

Abram: How?

Joe: I have never seen Thomas the Tank Engine.

Abram: I have, and you haven't.

Joe: Correct, but I have seen a lot of '80s cartoons that you have never seen. So, Thundercats, ho! Abram is telling me I have to leave.

Abram: Okay, so this is underrated. It's repetitive but very fun.

Joe: Is it an original or is it a cover?

Abram: The Beatles wrote it and they just gave it to the Stones and Ringo because they didn't like it.

Joe: No wonder he wants to be under the sea.

Abram: Yeah, they give their bad songs to him and he makes them a tiny bit better.

Joe: So I'm still only going for a 6 on this song.

Abram: I'm going for a— probably a 6.

Abram: Track 12, another cover. George's second cover, "Devil in Her Heart." I think it has strong drums. It's a performance, it's a 5.

Joe: Yeah, I agree. It's another cover. It's another gender swap. It was originally "Devil in His Heart," but I don't like it. It's a 5 for me.

Abram: Oh, it's a 4 now.

Joe: Right, cover penalty.

Abram: George does put on a pretty decent performance. Okay, now one of my personal favorites, track 13, "Not a Second Time." I think it has even stronger drums than the last time. Stronger pretty much everything than the last time, and it's not a cover. This, I think, is my favorite on the album.

Abram: I think it's good enough to give it an 8 though, because it's better than the first two.

Joe: I'm not sure that I think it's worth an 8. Um, I was only giving it a 6, but you've convinced me. 7.

Abram: Okay, now for the final song. Drum roll, please. Track 14, "Money (That's What I Want)." It's— I really don't like the intro. It just sounds too boingy for me. It's worse "Twist and Shout," in my opinion.

Joe: Well, I think that you're hitting an important thing here, which I think they were aiming for another gravelly voice song like "Twist and Shout." "Money" is another cover, 1959, another Motown song. Every time I give you a fact, Abram looks at me dirty like I'm taking away from his podcast. I'm sorry.

Abram: Okay, so since he's being kicked out, what's your rating?

Joe: I need to finish what I was going to say. This is the anti-John Lennon song, but it's sung by John Lennon. How is the guy who does a sleep-in where he and Yoko Ono sit in a bed while maids, you know, take care of their room—

Abram: "Don't give me money. That's not at all what I want." Jimmy, what are you saying? Dang it. Okay, so what do you rate it?

Joe: I'm only rating it a 6 because I don't think it's a great song.

Abram: I'm rating it a 4 because I don't like this. 3 and 5 are the actual scores, and you're being kicked out for real. Bye.

Joe: Don't kick me out.

Abram: Bye. Okay, so now that it's down to just two, I'm going to share my opinions on the best parts if I can find the paper. I'll have no one to argue with, of course, because I kicked out my co-host for knowing too much Motown facts.

Abram: I view "It Won't Be Long," "All My Loving," and "Not a Second Time" as very good songs. "It Won't Be Long" itself, as well as "Devil in Her Heart," I think are somewhat underrated. They aren't as popular as they should be.

Abram: "All My Loving" has the best guitar. "Hold Me Tight" has the best bass. "Not a Second Time" has the best drums. I do have to admit "Money (That's What I Want)" has the best vocals, even if it's ehh. The best harmonica on this album is "Little Child," even though that song is ehh. And the best piano is "Not a Second Time."

Abram: So our former co-host's rating is— okay, that's 78 out of 140. And my rating is 81 out of 140.

Abram: I think this album is better than the first by a little bit. "It Won't Be Long" is an underrated opener, while "All My Loving" is Paul's best early song. Then George gets a song that he wrote, something he would not do until Help!.

Abram: "Till There Was You" is an underrated cover, and "Mr. Postman" is pretty good. And yeah, all the covers are at least decent except "Money (That's What I Want)." That cover is really garbage.

Abram: So I think it's a good follow-up, but I don't think that it's amazing. I was going to have our former co-host say goodnight, but I guess not because he's been kicked out.

Joe: Abram, Abram, I just want to say that I really like this album, that it's a celebration of Americana, and that while the first Beatles album is very much about them breaking in, this really is an album that has a message, and I like it. And please invite me back to your podcast.

Abram: You're invited back next time. But was it funny that I actually kicked you out for knowing too much Motown?

Joe: I had great fun today. So is it say goodnight, Abram, or say goodnight, Dad?

Abram: Out.

Joe: This has been fun.

Joe: Prime Factors Music. I'm Joe, the true insider. I hope you had a great time. We'll see you next week.

Abram: Get out of here!

Joe: Ah!

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